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Pedro de Pacas 04-14-2006 01:08 PM

So I feel like an *** for explaining fall factor after two others did as well.

Excuse: I was writing the post. Which is way too long.

Pedro de Pacas 04-14-2006 01:09 PM

Dude I put in A S S and it made it into ***! Whats up with that?

Ricky 04-14-2006 01:37 PM

Thanks for the info.

skinsk 04-14-2006 01:42 PM

Practical advice: OK, I have read all these numerous articles, visitied the Mamut booth at shows and watched ropes being made. Basically, there is no math to determine when to retire a rope, but whenever you flake it, check for worn spots, etc. I tend to retire ropes when they begin to scare my climbing partners and/or myself. Deserts and beaches are definitely fun for climbing, but hard on ropes.

Yes Pedro, we are being censored. . . for so long I had **** (in relation to Bush) in my profile. . . suddenly the **** was gone, but Bush intact, go figure!

Pedro de Pacas 04-14-2006 01:56 PM

I agree with all of Craig Luebben's points delivered via Shanja on GriGri usage.

Pedro's advice: The best gear is the gear you know how to use.

The upshot: GriGris are hard on the core of a rope, 8s knot the rope, but if you are safer with either of these devices you should use it.

ricardo 04-14-2006 02:24 PM

pedro, i suggest you use @$$ or your native tongue "culo" :becky:

thanks for all the input everyone!!!

skinsk 04-14-2006 03:19 PM

I don't think the part about Gri Gris came from Craig. Craig has written about proper grigri usage in his beginner's guide. I have probably belayed Craig on my grigri (given the weight differential!).

There are times and places for grigris, ATCs, etc (even the munter hitch. . . )and room for personal preferences. No device is an excuse for sloppiness, laziness or inattention. Of course, you should learn to use any gear you buy!

I have never dropped a climber (grigri or ATC or butt-belaying), but I have been dropped by a belayer with an ATC. I do not blame the ATC. Most of you I have belayed with a grigri:)

A dynamic belay can be a good thing-- putting less tension on the rope and the climber. Dropping someone an extra few feet purposely to avoid a bulge or flake can prevent greater injury (as sometimes can taking in extra rope). . . I won't try either of these with an ATC, where if someone falls, I want to break them off! . . . try to break them mid-fall and you could get nasty rope burn on your hands, making it even harder to stop the rope.

We should start a new thread for belay devices. . . or someone want to nominate another piece of gear for discussion? I just (finally!) washed my rope last week, so I was just checking rope pages to remind myself if it was warm or cold water (cold). . . but always good to refresh/update your knowledge, especially as gear and climbing continue to evolve!

ricardo, pedro: how do Spanish-speakers say "**** bush" ?

ricardo 04-14-2006 04:28 PM

foya bush!!

Ricky 04-14-2006 04:40 PM

Maybe I'm so wrong on this. But I think, given the type of climbing I do, and the unlikely hood of a huge fall (because I'm such a wuss), I would feel better about having someone I don't really know well belay me on a gri-gri. Also, I would feel more comfortable belaying a heavy person on a gri-gri. I just think...if I get launched by a heavy fall, who knows where my arms are going to be flailing, and I'm afraid in that case I might actually drop the climber. I don't know...maybe that wouldn't happen.

Also. When I'm belaying that's usually part of my rest time for my pumping forearms. Belaying on a figure eight kind of tires them out. I like a gri-gri, because it doesn't require you to hold your hands up for the duration of the climb.

I'm all about the gri-gri. Funny cuz I don't actually have one. But I think it's safer for beginner climbers. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Oh! One more thing. Whether your being belayed on a gri-gri, atc, or figure eight, or butt (really wtf? That could give you worse A S S burn than jeollabuk-do kimchee) you should always check to make sure it's being used correctly by your belayer. And your belayer should be kind enough to check your knots and harness too.

Why do I say this. At climbing school. One of the guys put the gri-gri on completely upside down and the climber just got on the wall, unaware if she was properly secured. A bystanding teacher picked up the error before she got too far.

firedawgUSAF 04-14-2006 05:03 PM

If you are afraid of going airborne during a belay there are usually a bunch of things around you can make an anchor out of. When I first learned how to climb years ago in the boy scouts we were all required to be anchored into something that way in the event of someone much heavier than you falling you wouldnt go airborne. If your using webbing to build the anchor it is very simple. Just make sure its a good anchor strong tree for example. Hope this helps you ricky


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